On the same page 10, line 25, after the words "by the Secretary of the Interior," which is stricken out, we have inserted "head of the executive department having jurisdiction" and the rest of the section continues the same. Section 12, line 8, "Secretary of the Interior" is stricken out and instead "head of the executive department having jurisdiction is placed." Section 13, page 11 11 Mr. HARE. Why did you suggest the "head of the department having jurisdiction"? Is there any contemplation that there will be a change in the department's head? Mr. GOLDEN. No, sir. We did not know what the designation would be of the head of the department, and, therefore, we did not say "Secretary." It might be changed and, therefore, we did not say secretary. Mr. KNUTSON. It might be desirable to place it back under the Navy Department? Mr. GOLDEN. Yes; or the Military Department or the Department of Agriculture, or any other department. Besides, the feeling is, if we asked you definitely to place us under any one department, we would really be tying our hands to approach for any change that we thought would become necessary, or we would be limiting the Federal operations in the islands. In addition to that, we feel more independent Federal departments that act in the islands would act to the betterment of the islands. Mr. BRUMM. Do you know why this was placed under the Secretary of the Interior in the bill? Is there any special reason for that? Mr. WILLIAMS. It was placed there by Executive order of the President. Mr. KNUTSON. The suggestions made by Mr. Golden would seem to me to be all right. Mr. WILLIAMS. Yes; but there is no use to burden the record with that. Why not just let the record show that wherever the words "Secretary of the Interior" occur in the bill, the other should be placed in its stead? Mr. GOLDEN. Yes, sir. I shall not burden the record with it, except to comment on certain parts of it. There are certain reasons given for these changes. There is no reason of feeling dissatisfied with the Interior Department's administration of our affairs. We are not in here to make any accusations against anything of the sort. But to cite an example, we had the Department of Agriculture operating there as an independent branch of the Government. That has been placed now under the Department of Interior. That particular change of the Government service, has created a hardship and has not been any advancement to the betterment of the people of the islands; and for that reason we are anxious that Congress, in legislating for us, would allow the door to be opened for as many independent Federal departments operating in the islands as possible. Then again, we know from experience that when all these things are concentrated in one department, things are likely not to develop to the extent that they would when we had really independent branches operating with the object of making the islands successful and the people contented. In order to continue relative to the changes, you will observe from the copy of the bill which I present that it was amended by the council in session, and you will see the changes as compared relative to these marks in pencil on the bill in question. And there are some marks on it elucidating the matter. The question of changing "at large" where it speaks here of the members being elected from "at large"-we feel that is not at all in keeping with the desire of the people, and would not tend to improve conditions from an electoral point of view in the islands. Therefore the council eliminated the words "at large." Mr. KNUTSON. The purpose of that is to get a better distribution? Mr. GOLDEN. Yes, sir. Mr. KNUTSON. Rather than to obviate the danger of having these representatives elected by the more densely populated portions of the islands? Mr. GOLDEN. In answer to that, sir, I do not know really what is the object of it, except as you say, to have an election-if it is at large, it would be all over the islands, and we have now an election in the different districts, as made up, under our fundamental law, the colonial law under which we are operating, in connection with the Districts in St. Croix. Mr. HARE. Would you object to me interrupting you now? We will have a hearing to-morrow and you can continue your remarks when we convene then. I understand it was the direction of the joint committee that the chairman of this committee and the Senate Committee on Territories should introduce the draft as prepared by the Department of the Interior, as a working basis for the consideration of this matter? Mr. THOMAS. In copying our mimeographed copy, the "miscellaneous division" should be just above 33 instead of 34. It is just a small matter of form. Mr. GOLDEN. The delegates considered this almost a new draft and in going through it found, there are some things we will not be in accord with. Take for example, having a resident commissioner here. I think that is one of the things very essential to the Virgin Islands, and you have not a resident commissioner provided for in the organic act. In this bill which the honorable Secretary of the Interior has offered there is no provision for one; Senate bill 5227 does make such provision. I think you will be putting us back a step instead of bringing us forward if you do not make provision for that. Mr. HARE. There are some provisions of the bill which I do not approve myself, but at the request of the committee I will introduce it to-day. The committee will adjourn until to-morrow at 10 o'clock. (Thereupon, at 12 o'clock noon, the committee adjourned until Friday, January 20, 1933, at 10 o'clock a. m.) 157177-33 TO PROVIDE A CIVIL GOVERNMENT FOR THE VIRGIN ISLANDS OF THE UNITED STATES JOINT MEETING OF THE COMMITTEE ON TERRITORIES AND INSULAR INSULAR AFFAIRS OF THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES, Friday, January 20, 1933. The joint meeting began at 10 o'clock a. m., pursuant to agreement on adjournment, Senator Hiram Bingham (chairman) presiding. The CHAIRMAN. "The committee will be in order. STATEMENT OF ARNOLD M. GOLDEN-Resumed Mr. GOLDEN. Before resuming my testimony, I would like to make a few remarks regarding a statement made by Congressman Underhill relative to the independence of the Virgin Islands. Mr. HARE. That question need not come up for discussion at this time. It would take up our time on this matter. Mr. GOLDEN. I will simply say that the Virgin Islands are not asking for independence. The CHAIRMAN. It is not before us. We have the two bills on the organic act before us and would like to hear your views on the points to which you object. Mr. GOLDEN. I was only going to remark that if it was a question of electing our governor, that would be one thing, but as to independence we are not looking for that at present. Continuing my remarks on the objections to the bill which now is changed from S. 5227 to the one that has been introduced by the Department of the Interior, under section 4 of that particular bill, in the legislative branch, on page 2 as it is here, we would like to strike out the words "at large." The CHAIRMAN. S. 5227, Mr. GOLDEN. No, the bill introduced here by the Department of the Interior. Mr. WILLIAMS. What section? Mr. GOLDEN. Section 4-legislative branch is the heading. Mr. WILLIAMS. What page? Mr. GOLDEN. Page 2. The words "at large." To have that stricken will correspond with the amendments that the council offered to the bill S. 5227. The CHAIRMAN. You do not want any members elected at large? Mr. GOLDEN. No, sir; it should mean the members shall be elected in four representative districts, one of which shall be, and so forth. Mr. WILLIAMS. The words "at large" should be stricken out. 49 Mr. GOLDEN. Yes. You will find also in our amendment offered, which I filed with the clerk, from the council, that the ratio should be 1,000 or a major portion of the population. Mr. WILLIAMS. Did you or Mr. Alexander yesterday suggest that they be elected from districts as at large? Mr. GOLDEN. No. "At large" is to be stricken out. Mr. ALEXANDER. That was with reference to the municipal committee. Mr. GOLDEN. Section 6 of this same bill in question in the Department of the Interior, which provides for joint sessions of the council, makes no provision in the bill for a presiding officer, and I think it would not be amiss if something to that effect should be stated in the organic act, that when the bodies meet they should elect their own officers for the session. To explain a little more in the matter, the two councils have rules of business, and while they may be similar there may be some differences, and each one is presided over by a chairman or secretary. It is a joint session, and avoiding any question of precedence of one over the other I think the matter should be left to the councils when they meet to elect their presiding officers. Section 9 of the same bill in question of the department, I will take up next, and the colonial council made amendments to the bill S. 5227, which bears a different section in that bill. The CHAIRMAN. You may refer to the bill drafted by the Secretary of the Interior as S. 5457, which will be inserted in the record at this point. [S. 5457, Seventy-second Congress, second session] A BILL To provide a civil government for the Virgin Islands of the United States Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled, That the provisions of this act and the name "The Virgin Islands of the United States" as used in this act shall apply to and include the territorial domain, lands, and waters acquired by the United States through cession of the Danish West Indian Islands by the convention between the United States of America and His Majesty the King of Denmark, entered into August 4, 1916, and ratified by the Senate of the United States on September 7, 1916 (39 Stat. L. 1706). SEC. 2. That the Virgin Islands of the United States shall be divided into two municipalities, namely (1) the municipality of Sait Croix, and (2) the municipality of Saint Thomas and Saint John. The boundaries of said municipalities shall be the same as at present established in accordance with laws in force, and the capital and seat of government shall be Saint Thomas. SEC. 3. That the inhabitants of the municipality of Saint Croix and of the municipality of Saint Thomas and Saint John are hereby constituted into bodies politic and juridic, under the present name of each such municipality, and they shall have perpetual succession and power (a) to adopt and use an official seal; (b) to sue and be sued; (c) to demand the fulfillment of obligations under the law and to defend and prosecute all actions at law; (d) to acquire property by exchange, donation, or bequest, or by virtue of proceedings for the collection of taxes, or by eminent domain proceedings, or by any other means provided by law, and to possess, administer, and govern such property; and (e) to alienate or encumber any of their property, subject to the provisions of this act. LEGISLATIVE BRANCH SEC. 4. That all local legislative powers in the municipality of Saint Croix, except as herein otherwise provided, shall be vested in a municipal council which shall be designated the Municipal Council of Saint Croix." Said council shall consist of members elected for a term of four years by the qualified electors of the municipality of Saint Croix. The members shall be elected at large in four representative districts, one of which shall be the town of Christiansted and suburbs; one of which shall be the country district of Christiansted; one of which |