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been disposed of yesterday. The opponents of an altered state of facts, with the ceasing of the amount of the allowance in a state of uncertainty, che bill as it came from the House determined, necessity upon which the grant was made, was a when the law, as it now stands, requires this addihowever, that the discussion should be continued; | fair and rational inference, in my judgment, as to tional vessel to be built. at least I judge so from the votes which were the future action of Congress under the power of What are the objections to this application ? taken on questions of adjournment; and the debate revocation. But what, in fact, has since ensued ? | for I take it for granted that the contractors have took such a course that I feel myself compelled to In 1854, just before the close of the session of applied to be relieved from this clause in the law make some remarks in reference to the amendment | Congress, when there was in the Houae of Rep. 1 of 1852. I do not know that it is so, but I take i before the Senate, not because I have any hope of resentatives a bare quorum present—one hundred it for granted; and the House of Representatives changing the vote of any Senators in reference to and thirty-two members, ihe vote being forty- || have seen fit, after discussion, to agree to that apthis proposition, but because I consider the course seven to eighty-five, one hundred and two being || plication, and repeal the proviso in the law of of debate has been such as to require, for my own absent_although it was at least questionable, and, | 1852. What are the objections, sir? The first justification, that I should give a brief explanation in my judgment, certain, that by the true con. is, that it is the invariable practice of the Govof the reasons which will govern my vote. struction of that proviso, the time had not arrived ernment, in all its mail contracts, to reserve the

Mr. President, when the system was adopted at which Congress could give the notice in good right to determine the contract within the term to by Congress, following the example of Great Brit- | faith, the House passed a bill authorizing and re- which it is originally limited by the executive offiain, of providing vessels intended to be auxiliary quiring the notice to be given by the Postmaster cer. I concede that such is the practice; I concede to the Navy in the event of war, and to be em- General; and this without investigation, or suf- that such a practice is a wise and proper one; but, ployed during peace in the transportation of the cient cause. When that bill came to this body, || like all other rules, it has its exceptions; and I mails, I was not a member of this body, nor for there was also a bare quorum here, and the notice hold that you cannot properly apply such a rule, several years after. It was in full operation when was stricken out by a majority of only two votes. whether leaving it to the discretion of Congress, I became a member. If, however, I had been here, | I draw very different conclusions from these votes which is a mosi unfit body, as its previous action in accordance with the principles which, on a for- from those of the Senator from Tennessee, (Mr. || shows, or to that of an executive officer, to termimer occasion, I stated to the Senate, I should have | Jones.) At the present session, in a full House, nate a contract of this kind; for the reason, that been disinclined to adopt the system except in and after a prolonged discussion, the same body the character of the service is one that requires cases where a rival line existed, which was sup- which, with a bare quorum, last year passed by a such an amount of capital to be embarked, that ported by the money or the Treasury of another large majority a bill requiring the notice to be you can get no man or set of men to make an oriGovernment. In that excepted case only would given peremptorily before the proper time arrived, ginal contract, no matter whether for five, or six, I have been content that the Government of the have this year, after a careful investigation, by a ör ten years, subject to the right of the GovernUnited States should connect itself with any sys-decided, though not a large majority, determined ment to reserve such a discretion. tem of the kind, and should have preferred leaving not only that they would not give the notice, but In the original contract with these parties, there it otherwise to individual enterprise. But the experience had shown that it was unwise that this is no such provision. You granted it for ten years. system was established.

provision should exist in the contract. Was it Why did you do it? For the very reason which After. Congress had determined upon that not a just conclusion?

I have stated. Honorable Senators here, within course, at the solicitation of the Government, Mr. These contractors have embarked in this matter the past few days, when they were desirous of Collins and his associates embarked in this enter- a very large capital. They are carrying on one aiding in the construction of a railroad from the prise, which was new and untried to them, and of the most expensive undertakings that could Pacific to the Mississippi, did not hesitate to which, like all other new and untried enterprises, well be imagined. If they found that, at each ses- require that a contract should be entered into for : necessarily involved expenditures and disappoint- sion of Congress, they were liable to be placed in fifteen years, for the payment of not exceeding ments which human judgment and human saga- a position in which this allowance might be with- | $300 a mile for the transportation of the mail on city could not foresee. They embarked in it in drawn, not upon a judgment founded on informa- that road. I was opposed to that bill on other good faith, and as I shall show before I have done, tion afforded io Congress, not upon a consideration grounds, which I thought legitimate and right; but whatever may be the technicalities of their con- of the commercial interests of the country, but there was no hesitation, no difficulty, in providing tract, they have carried it out substantially and upon the mere caprice of Congress-was it not that the contract, under such circumstances, should fully in good faith, so as to promote the purposes natural that they should wi to get rid of that be extended for fifteen years, without any proviso and objects intended to be effected by Congress. I provision, especially when, in consequence of the of a right to decrease the allowance at the discre. Finding that the expenses in the new enterprise loss of one vessel, which they were originally tion of Congress. were far greater than they anticipated, and that bound by Congress to construct, they were under Mr. President, undoubtedly the general practice there were additional difficulties to be encountered the necessity of constructing another in its place and rule of the Government, applying to the ordiin the want of means for the construction of ma- at a cost of $700,000—was it not natural, under nary transactions of the Post Office Department, in chinery adapted to the class of vessels necessary these circumstances, that they should wish to have giving a discretion to the Postmaster General, is a to effect the objects of the Government-(for to some certainly as to their future prospects, some wise and reasonable regulation; but when you have constructed an inferior class of vessels, une- certainty after their contract had lasted for five attempt to apply it to a line of steamships estab- ! qual in speed to the existing line established by || years, and left them still absolute losers under it, lished for particular purposes, one purpose in caso the British Government would have been idle). and had but five years more to run, with all the of war, and a distinct purpose and use in peacewhich involved the investment of a capital of time, labor, and anxiety which had been involved which involves a capital of millions of dollars, and nearly $3,000,000, and current monthly expendi- || in the business, that they would be permitted to an enormous annual expenditure—which is to be tures far beyond their calculations, in 1852 they make up for the losses sustained, and secure some a rival to the line established by the Government came before Congress, made a statement of the reasonable profit under the contract? It was a of Great Britain, and supported by the Treasury facts, and Congress, after full investigation and reasonable desire; and I think the judgment of of Great Britain, you should not expect capitalista discussion, agreed to extend the compensation the House of Representatives in determining to to enter into a contract with a condition attached which they were entitled to receive under the con- abandon this proviso, was a natural consequence, || that it shall be in the discretion either of the exec- ! tract. The British Government had done the arising from the precipitate action of a mere quo-utive or of the legislative department to terminate same thing in reference to their line on two seve- rum of the body at the close of the last session of the allowance. In making the additional grant, no ral occasions; and on similar grounds Congress | Congress. This is the view I take of the legisla- || doubt those who reserved the right had the power adopted that policy.

tion here, Mr. President. The danger to these to do so. The question is, whether it was wise I do not mean to go into the details, but to state, contractors when they are called upon to construct to do so? I think it better, from our experience, as briefly as I can, the course of proceeding in this another steamer at a cost of $600,000 or $700,000, to abandon the right.'. matter.

is the liability which exists to the exercise of There is, at least, connected with this contract There was attached to the bill which increased | this discretionary power by Congress, not upon one merit to which the parties are entitled. They } the compensation a proviso, leaving it within the grounds of investigation, not upon grounds of embarked in a new and untried business, and at discretion of Congress to withdraw the additional justice, but upon grounds, such as I have stated, the solicitation of the Government; and the mocompensation at any time, with six months' notice, either on the interference of other persons who ment they did so, the Government of Great Britain after the 31st of December, 1854. I did not approve desire to make a profit, and yet who were unwilling established an additional line between New York of that proviso then, and subsequent experience to incur the risk of loss in the first instance, or on and Liverpool, and the effect of the establishment has strengthened my convictions of its impolicy. I the mere caprice of some individual members in of our line led to the postal treaty with Great In March, 1853, under representations made of bringing the matter before Congress, when there Britain. Though that postal treaty is unequal and the large expenditures upon all the mail steamer is no time for investigation and deliberate action. imperfect in many respects, yet it is better than lines, Congress authorized advertisements to be Under these circumstances it is not to be ex- any previous state of affairs. Though its inequal. issued by the Postmaster General, with the view | pected, it would not be rational to suppose, that itiés ought to be remedied, it is not by the abanto ascertain at what prices the services performed ihe contractors would not desire, in their future donment of this line that you can expect to reach by them respectively could be accomplished. Il operations, that they should have some certainty that result. shall notice that advertisement hereafter; I believe as to the compensation which they were to receive. I have stated the character of the enterprise, and it has not been yet referred to in this debate. On the part of the Government, 1 deem it a wise the magnitude of the capital involved in this

The natural belief on the part of the contractors, measure to abandon this power, because, other-matter, together with the fact that they had to and of every other man was, that in the reserva- wise, we shall have this question constantly contend with a line backed by the Treasury of tion of the power to revoke the additional allow- || brought before us. If we were to agree to the Great Britain, which placed it in a very different ance, Congress would be governed in its exercise, recommendation of the Committee of Finance, | position from our ordinary contracts for postal not by caprice, not by the assailing efforts of indio which does not propose to give the notice, but service throughout the country, whether by land viduals outside of the body, nor by any other | merely to retain the power, there would be but or by water. influence than a fair inquiry into the matter. That three years of the contract remaining when any The next objection is, that we are paying for the additional grant would not be recalled but for notice could be given, and the saving would be this line an enormous sum, greater than you could just reasons, and after investigation demonstrating ll too trivial, in my judgment, to justify keeping the ll establish a line for, and that great profis will be


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made under it. Now, sir, under our discretionary their expenditures, over the loss by depreciation citizens, at the invitation of the Government, power, beyond all question, if we should find that and the interest at seven per cent., by the sum of through one of your Government officers, the exorbitant profits are to be made by this line, it $253,924. They are still losers to that amount, Postmaster General, and at his solicitation, emwould be a perfectly just cause, in my judgment, and that, too, after the contract has been going on barked in this enterprise, which was a new and for repealing the extra allowance; but when you for five years, three of them being since the ad- untried one. They found it more costly than they come to investigate the facts, when you have | ditional compensation was made. You have no expected. In the progress of the contract they sworn statements, giving the details of every counter-evidence to this that can possibly meet it. applied to you for an additional compensation, and voyage of these steamers down to 1855, giving the You have the case presented to you precisely on after giving a statement of facts, and after a full expenses of each one, and the disbursements the same grounds on which you granted the ad- investigation, it was granted. of each one, and showing the difference between ditional allowance. These men having entered Gentlemen have not shown me, nor can they the expenditures and the receipts, under the con- into a contract in good faith, and having carried show me, that the reasons which induced the tract, from all sources, you find, when you make out the objects which you had in view in good Government to make that grant have ceased now. the ordinary and necessary allowance for depre- || faith, you would not suffer them to be destroyed It is true, as has been stated, that the Cunard line ciation from use, and for the mere interest upon under the operation of the contract, but made is not now running to New York, but it has been the capital which is involved, that the owners them an additional grant, reserving to yourselves called off by the exigency of the war in Europe; of this line, after an existence of five years, this contingent right of revocation without determ- || but there is nothing to show us that it will not be are positive losers. Although the Senator from ining what your policy would be when the con- reëstablished. Beyond all question the expenses Tennessee may say that that has nothing to do tract should expire. Ought not the same consid- connected with the running of a steamer between with the contract, does it not enter into the equity erations to induce you, looking at the probable Liverpool and New York, have been increased in of the case, as to whether. Congress shall with profits of the last five years of their contract to the last two years, and no reason has been given draw the additional allowance which they made abandon that right, and prevent a further agita- || for altering now the determination of Congress in on the ground that these men, having embarked tion of the matter, which is injurious to the con- making the grant at that time, which would not in the contract with good faith, had performed it tractors, and without benefit to the Government. as fully have existed then. When you have a in good faith? I speak not of the technicalities of In connection with this, I may be allowed to further appeal made by your citizens, showing the contract; but is it not an answer to the posi- remark on the figures of the honorable Senator that, having embarked in this matter, they are tion, that now you ought to withdraw that allow- from Tennessee, (Mr. Jones.] He gives us a still, after five years' service, losers by their conance, when they show you fairly and fully that statement to the effect, I believe, that something tract, is it asking too much to have this restriction they are yet under an actual loss; and that, after over $7,000,000 will be paid to this company removed, so that they may not be liable to be five years of continual struggle, they have suc- during the whole time of their contract; and we called here at each successive session of Congress, ceeded in establishing a line which not only equals, are told that it is monstrous that such a sum to defend the grant which was made to them in but excels, the line which was established years should be paid on a capital of but $3,000,000! | 1852, when they succeeded in showing that the before by Great Britain, with all the advantages He even attempts to underrate the amount of the amount then granted was but a fair compensation which it had of being an established line?

capital, as I understood him, by showing that for the services performed? Though it be perfectly true that, owing to the but something over $1,500,000 were subscribed, It may be perfectly true, therefore, that, within contingency of the war in Europe, a portion of and that the rest was borrowed. Be it so. But, the terms of the contract originally made, you are the line established by Great Britain has been with | surely, if it was not subscribed but borrowed, it only bound to pay a certain sum per trip, and that, drawn, it is but a temporary withdrawal, and there forms a part of the capital of the enterprise. The under your additional grant, though you are bound is no evidence, there is no attempt to show that vessels, beyond all question, cost nearly $2,900,000. to pay $33,000 per trip, you have the power to there can be any extraordinary profils derived | There must have been incidental expenses in the revoke the additional allowance if you see fit; bat during the next five years. But if they do make establishment of the line which would run the unless some malperformance is shown on the part large profits hereafter, according to my sense of amount up to $3,000,000; and though that may of the contractors, or the fact is proved that they justice, they are fairly entitled to them, and will not all have been subscribed, though some of it receive exorbitant profits, though it may be in not be extravagantly remunerated for the hazards may have been borrowed, it forms part of the your power, I deny the equity and justice of such they have encountered, and the success they have capital. But waiving all that, whether their capi- an act on the part of the Government of this achieved. They embarked in this business at your tal is $2,000,000 or $3,000,000, it is immaterial; country. The two reasons which I have specified own solicitation; they have performed their con- there is really nothing in the argument—though I are, in my judgment, the only two which could tract, as I say, in good faith; and having done so, heard it once before on this floor-that there is any justify that act. I should not hesitate, after having made the grant || impropriety in a large annual grant, because the Again, Mr. President, we are told, as another of additional compensation, and finding they are amount of the grant appears great in reference to reason why this power to give notice should be still losers, to say that it is impossible, during the the capital employed. You have not a common retained, that an offer has been made to run mail five years remaining, that they can make any more ordinary horse conveyance of the mail in the steamers on this line by another person (Captain than a reasonable remuneration for the losses country in reference to which the annual amount Vanderbilt) for a much less sum than is now paid which they have sustained. Does any gentleman which you pay does not probably quadruple the by the Government to the Collins line. Mr. Pressuppose that they entered into an operation of this amount of actual capital invested. It is con- ident, suppose it be so; I think I do no injustice kind with the mere view of making only seven per stantly the case. You make the grant founded on to Captain Vanderbilt in saying that, though he cent. interest upon their money, while they were the running expenses as well as on the capital; is a very shrewd and a very sagacious man, thor. hazarding the loss and destruction of their capital? | and, therefore, all this parade of figures of the oughly acquainted with steamboat matters, and a Would that remunerate them for the time, labor, amount which you pay should be weighed with very enterprising man, yet his offer, uncertain as and anxiety of mind, and the chances of entire reference, if justly presented, to the expenditures it is in many respects, should not be regarded. loss which are involved in such a business? Treat which are necessary to carry on the business, and Sir, the circumstances are these: He comes here, such contractors as some Senators seem disposed | also to the objects which the Government desires in my judgment, as an interloper. When, five to treat them, and you will look in vain, in the to attain. In this case the mere receipts of post- or seven years ago, the Government was willing to future, for any contracts being made with the age did not constitute the only objeci which the enter into a contract which he might have entered Government by persons who really can carry them

Government had in view. I shall not enter into into as well as others, when the business was new out in good faith.

the details on that matter, because I am not suffi- l) and untried, and all the difficulties connected with Sir, these cortractors have been losers hitherto. ciently conversant with them. It is an unques- it were to be encountered, he shrunk from it, and The statement which you have here distinctly | tioned fact, however, that, in regard to the postal | left the hazard to others. Yet now, when what made, and sworn to by one of the clerks, or by service, you have derived the benefit of the estab- was then a new line, running against an estab. the secretary of the company, in which he gives lishment of the postal treaty from the establish- lished line, has become itself an established line, the disbursements of each ship and the receipts ment of this line; and it is another unquestioned he steps in, and offers to perform it for a less sum, from every source, proves that taking the entire fact that the receipts of postages through the line although the contract which was made by the receipts from passengers, and freight, and the have been increasing steadily from its first estab- Government with the other parties who have undermails, from the commencement of the line Antil | lishment, and that against discriminations on con- gone all the expense and difficulties and hazards the 17th of February, 1855, you have receipts tinental letters by Great Britain, most unjust and of a new enterprise has not expired. He offers amounting to $7,874,17334, and disbursements for unequal to us, under the operation of that treaty. to perform this work for a less sum, having the the mere running expenses, expenses actually in- | 1 do not pause now to enter into the facts with benefit of their knowledge, and of their previous curred and paid, $7,207,291 91, leaving what is which the Senate is familiar. Under all these cir- labor in establishing a line successfully, which is called in the statement, a surplus-but it is not a cumstances, there has been an advance and in- the great difficulty in all transactions of this sort. susplus-leaving the difference between the ex- crease of postage year by year. But, further, Mr. Sir, this proposition meets with no favor at my penditures and receipts in the period of five years || President, when this question was mooted in the hands. which the contract has run, with a capital of Senate, in 1852, I said, and I still think, that it But further, Mr. President, I doubt the whole $3,000,000 involved, but $667,481 47. This neither was very probable that the postages might not character of the proposition, and I will give the includes the loss by depreciation, which of neces- | equal the amount of the disbursement during the reasons for it. On our tables were laid, after sity enters into all steaming operations, nor does it || period of the contract. I saw no reason, then, this bill had passed the House, printed propoinclude the mere interest on the money. When you when I looked to the nationality of the interest sitions from Captain Vanderbilt, which disclose come to deduct the losses which have been actually which I conceived was embarked in this line, why nothing but the fact that he is willing to contract sustained, the loss of the ill-fated Arctic, and the the Government should abandon the contract into to run a line, without any description of the vesdepreciation on the other vessels according to the which it induced the parties to enter, although it sels which he would employ, and without any seitled experience of men who have been engaged did not get an exact remuneration in money, from allegation as to the time which he would make in the business, and the interest of seven per cent. the postages, for the amount which it was paying between Liverpool and New York, for $15,000 & on the capital, you find that they are still out of to the contractors. I think so still.

trip. That is the proposition? When, in answer pocket, or in other words, they have not received The facts may be summed up thus. Your own to the honorable Senator from Tennessee, (Mr. 330 CONG....20 Sess.

Mail Steamer Appropriation BillDebate.


Jones,) I showed that, within the terms of that contractors, and which also, if it is released, pro- | sels were constructed, as indicated in the policy of offer, such a line might well be run, and make a vides that they shall build an additional ship, | the Government, for the purposes of war as well profit, while the Collins line, running at the speed which will be useful for future purposes, as well as for the purposes of the postal service in peace, that they do, would experience a loss--that, run- as for the present. That cannot be called a new and the Government has the option of iaking ning inferior vessels, and running at a slower contract; it is simply a modification, or an aban- | them at a valuation. It was alleged in 1852 that speed, such a line might be kept up for that sum, | donment rather, by Congress, of the right of revo- they were useless for purposes of war. I admitted and yet that the Government would lose by the cation inserted in the original contract. There is no then what I have some doubts about now-that operation, in postages, an amount quite equal to proposition to extend the time of the original con- as between the side-wheel steamer and the prothe difference in cost between the two lines, then iract; there is no proposition to establish a new line | peller, the propeller was the most efficient vessel the Senator from Tennessee stated that Captain | by these old contractors. They ask you whether, for purposes of war. I doubt it now. I shall not Vanderbilt had assured him that he was willing | in justice not only to the country, but to them, enter into that vexed question. I shall not venture to make the Collins time, or the Cunard time, I do you will not give them a certainty that they shall to controvert the much superior information and not know which, for $15,000 a trip. Sir, when a receive the compensation, within the terms of the knowledge on naval subjects of the honorable man comes here, and has his agents here for the contract, for the period during which it was given | Senator from Florida, [Mr. MALLORY;) but there purpose of acting upon the legislation of Congress, to them after full investigation? They ask whether are some malters connected with this that I will and preventing the passage of a provision intended you will not give them a certainty that it shall be allude to in order to show that he is under an error for the benefit of men who entered into a contract continued during the remaining period of the ori. | in his allegation as regards the inutility of these when the business was one of uncertainty, indeed l ginal contract into which they entered, and on the || vessels for war purposes. I may express it as a almost an unknown business, and when it was condition that they shall construct an additional general result, first, that of all the steamers that impossible to estimate the expenditures which vessel? This is no new contract. I view it as a you have had built under this policy, the Collins would have to be incurred, when he occupies that proposition to carry out, under this bill as it comes line alone have complied substantially with the position, lies by, and makes no such proposition from the House, our original contract with the terins of the contract in building their vessels to while the matter is being investigated before one parties, in substance, in good faith, and according | suit war purposes. If it be true, according to the body, and not until he finds that it is carried, and to the object of Congress at the time it was made. view of the honorable Senator from Florida, that that his schemes are defeated, does he come for- I have stated that this contract has been per- a war steamer must be able to engage at the disward with his verbal assurance that he would do formed in substance and in good faith on the part tance of pistol shot, broadside to broadside, then the same work for a less sum; are we to legis- of the contractors. Let me endeavor to show the Saranac is not a war steamer; the Susquelate on such a state of facts, and take the chances that. Will any gentleman deny that as regards | hanna is not a war steamer; you have no war of whether he will comply with that assurance or the postal service, the contract with Collins and steamers in the Navy unless they be the Princenot? Such considerations ought not, in my judg. | his associates has been fully and faithfully carried ton and the San Jacinto. Where does the honment, to influence the legislation of Congress. out? You stipulated for no time. You stipulatedorable Senator obtain his authority? He has dis

Further, Mr. President, on the 30 March, 1853, for a certain number of vessels; but your most avowed that of Charles Stewart. Now, with all under an allegation that the Collins line, and other important stipulation was for the trips to be per- | my respect for the honorable Senatcr, I would established lines, were expensive, you authorized || formed; have they failed in that? No. As to rather take the opinion of one of the most distinthe Postmaster General to advertise for proposals time, have not these men constructed their vessels | guished captains of our Navy, who has been fisty, for the transportation of the mail between New not only regardless of expense to themselves, but years in the service, and is thoroughly acquainted York and Liverpool, as well as on other lines; and in order to carry the mails in the quickest possible with the arts of seamanship, in regard to the fightin answer to those proposals where was Captain | time, and have they not run all sorts of hazards? | ing capacity of a vessel, than that of the honorable Vanderbilt? No offer whatever came from him; || Have they not succeeded in giving a superiority, Senator from Florida. no proposal was made by him to run a line then in point of time, to your postal service over the Mr. President, you have the opinion of Comfor $15,000 a trip: No proposition came from any postal service of the established line of Great | modore Stewart, and I want no higher opinion. source to establish a line, except one from the Gal- | Britain, which had existed for years anterior? || I am always willing to avail myself, in maiters of way company, which proposed to leave the sum They have, therefore, I say, performed their con- that kind, of the opinions of those who are particuto the discretion of Congress, and that was con- tract in good faith. That they have built one ves- larly instructed in them. You have the opinion of sidered such an entirely vague proposition as to be sel less than was specified is immaterial. They || Commodore Stewart, that those vessels are built unworthy of notice. "Now,

ask, having gone have performed the contract by making the trips for the purposes of war; you have the same opinthrough with that process before, if this offer was regularly according to its terms, and making them ion from Commodore Perry-and I will state furintended as a fair and bona fide offer, in regard to in the quickest time, though the contract did not ther, that although originally Commodore Perry the matter of the expense for equal service, whe- so require. They have made the best time that thought it might be necessary to remove the upper ther it would not have been made when the adver- could be made, and they have spared no exertion decks, in the event of preparing them for war tisements were issued, two years ago, and when or expense to do that.

steamers, he does not now entertain that opinion, this extra allowance had been in operation for Take the single item of loss, to show how this as I understood from him in a personal convernearly one year?

thing operates, which occurred within the last six | sation within the last few weeks. That such Mr. President, I consider this as a mere effort, | monihs. In running up the Irish channel, one of vessels could not fight at pistol shot I admit, but when I look at the whole circumstances of the their steamers ran into a vessel, and sunk her. the capacity of such a vessel for war purposes does case, made by an opponent of this line on personal || That will cost them $100,000, because the courts not depend on that. It is perfectly true, that, in grounds, or from some other cause,

of justice usually decide under general prin oles, || former times, when you had sailing vessels alone, know what; nor if I knew it would I state it here where a steamer runs into a sailing vessel, the l of necessity, when vessels encountered each other in the Senate; but it bears on its face indelibly the steamer is responsible for the injury which is done. l hostilely, they were brought into close contact in impression of something of that kind,) to defeat a That was not an act of carelessness; it was an act order to determine their relative superiority, beproposition which he supposes will be beneficial to which may frequently occur, because that channel cause one vessel, controlled by such an element men and interests to which he is opposed. That | is densely crowded with vessels. It is also very as wind, though she might have the advantage of certainly would never get my sanction, that would liable to fogs; and yet, unless these steamers run speed, in taking her position, could not maintain never influence my determination as a legislator. with a certain degree of speed, they would not that while firing upon her adversary so as to do

I concede the ability of Captain Vanderbilt. I carry out the wishes of the commercial people of her material injury, and prevent her approach; believe he is a millionaire, and that he is an enter- this country, in giving speed to the transmission but with the element of steam as a motive power, prising man, and one of great shrewdness and of the mail. It is in order to accomplish that where there is a decided superiority in the velocity capacity for business; but suppose that this offer object, that they run these hazards, and these of the vessel, then the vessel having the superior were made by him; I ask if a question of dollars hazards they have to pay for. I recollect, on my velocity, though she may not have the same numand cents would induce the Government of the voyage in the Pacific, we nearly came in collision ber of guns on board, beyond all question, must United States, when it had previously entered into with another vessel. We were running slowly at overcome the vessel which is inferior in speed. a contract for a period of ten years, with contract- the time, about eight knots an hour. The fog If a vessel is capable of carrying ten-inch guns, ors who had embarked in the business at its soli- was so dense that we could not see ten or twelve and throwing those projectiles used in modern citation, and had invested a large capital on the feet ahead, and by a rapid shifting of the helm, we warfare, one of which, the honorable Senator tells faith of the contract, who have lost money by the barely escaped running down a vessel which must us, would be sufficient to destroy a ship if it operation so far, to suffer them to be destroyed otherwise have been lost, but which, fortunately, || struck her near the water line, does it not stand because there exists a power to withdraw the we merely grazed, and passed without injury. to reason, that if that vessel has four or five knots allowance and permit another party to come in and These are matters of frequent occurrence, because greater speed than her adversary, no matter what make profits at a time when—by the energy, the the channel is always crowded; the fogs are inces- is the relative strength of the two, she can, with skill, and the enterprise of the previous contract- sant at particular periods of the year; but the such an element as steam, take her position at ors—they were about to be in some measure re- people of this country want speed, and, in order such a distance as effectually to throw her shot, munerated ? I trust such a consideration will never to accomplish that, they must hazard the vessels, whilst exposing only her bow to the attack of her influence the Senate of the United States.

and run the risk of experiencing such losses. Il opponent? It is perfectly well known that there Mr. President, this matter has been spoken of mention this only as an incident to show that it is is an angle within which, if the bows of the ves. as if a new contract were proposed to be made by not through negligence that these things occur, sel fall, a shot will glance when it strikes; and the bill under the consideration of the Senate, | but from a desire, regardless of expense, to carry these vessels are constructed so sharp as to come which has been sent to us from the House of out, in good faith, as regards the postal service, ll within that angle, and, bow on, they encounter Representatives. It is not so. The proposition their contract with the Government, not only little risk of injury from a hostile vessel. is this: You are asked, under the bill from the making their trips regularly, but making them in I have had a conversation, of which I took a House of Representatives, to release one of the | a time not equaled by any other line.

short memorandum, with the chief engineer of terms of the contract which renders uncertain and Mr. President, I come now to the question con- your Navy. He has been in your service fourteen unsettled the compensation which is given to those Il nected with the war steamer clause.' These vcs. Il years. He has sailed, under the orders or permis

do not

330 CONG....20 Sess.

Mail Steamer Appropriation Bill-Debate.


with the Baltic."




sion of the Government, six voyages in the Arctic, il is that of Captain McKennon, of the British Navy, them without any risk of danger to the vessels, and six in the Pacific. He has been four years in who certainly was not prejudiced in favor of the and that, in such vessels as those of the Cunard the Mississippi, and twenty-one months in the American steamers. He gives the unqualified line, there is no difficulty whatever in carrying Saranac. He considers that there is no compari- opinion that the Baltic is, out and out, the fastest ten-inch guns and firing them. That is his testison in the capacity for war purposes between the vessel afloat. His language is very strong, and 1 mony, which is given in detail. I shall not trouble Collins steamers and these vessels; that one could i will read it:

the Senate with reading the whole of it; but I overpower the other, with nothing like an equal “I tell them again plainly, however unpleasant to myself, shall read one or two of his answers: armament, with the utmost facility, owing to the that there are no ocean steamers in England comparable “ J. R. ENGLEDUE called in, and further examined. difference of speed; and to illustrate that, having

“ Chairman, Have you any addition to make to the sailed in them all, he told me that he considered This is the language of a distinguished officer in evidence you gave on a former day? Yes; one point is he had no doubt-chat, against a gale at sea, the British service. Then he says:

with reference to the weight of guns for second-class sized

steam vessels." these Collins steamers could make five knots an “I am only doing justice to these magnificent vessels in

stating that they are, beyond any competition, the finest, That is the British marine service. hour, while any steam frigate in your Navy would

the fastest, and ihe best sea boats in the world.

I am sorry be carried astern. He told me that the Collins

"I think I was not sufficiently explicit on the last occalo be obliged to say this; but, as a naval officer, I feel bound

sion; that is, I merely stated that they were capable of carsteamers were stronger built than either of those in candor to admit their great superiority.

rying guns. I now wish to state that I think they are all frigates I have mentioned; that the depth being He gives the details of his passage in the Amer- capable of carrying sixty-eight-pounder guns. greater--the depth of the Collins steamers is six ica, one of the Cunard line; he sailed in both the

In addition 10 the thirty-two-pounder guns which you feet more than that of the Mississippi or Saranac- Baltic and America, and he states that there can

formerly stated they could carry on their quarter decks? made them stronger for the purpose of performing be no comparison between them at all.

“Mr. CORRY. Is that a sixty-five cwt.gun? Yes. their duties on the ocean. It is not, however, Again, sir, there is another high authority that

When you speak of second-class necessary for me to enter into the details of these touches all these questions, and that is Commander

steamers, you mean second sized steamers? Yes; of fron

Ave hundred to eight hundred tons. matters here, even were I fully master of the sub- | Lynch, of your own Navy. Certainly he is a man

“ From your experience and knowledge of the steam ject.

of science and capacity. Having been a passen- vessels in her Majesty's service, do you consider it possiWell, sir, with the superiority of speed to this ger on one of these vessels, he writes about the ble to fit mercantile steainers of the same size with equal extent, the vessel takes her own position; with Arctic:

armaments? Yes, certainly.

“What further filtings would you require ? would you her bows to her opponent, (unlike a sailing vessel, “I examined her closely, and do, as far as I am capable

require any additional fittings to those which have been she can keep that position with steam, or she can of judging, consider that in strength and beauty of construc

already spoken of? No; except bullrings, and places for go backwards or forwards,) she remains in the tion, in stability, combined with bouyancy, in dryness, and

the pivots for shifting the slides round.” in speed, she surpasses any other vessel, nalional or inersame relative position, spite of the efforts of her cantile, I have cver known; and I have ihree times before

Then, at the close of his deposition, he says: opponent to get out of it, and she remains with

crossed the Atlantic by steam, and twice commanded “In order to show practically the facility with which meran elevation above the water, which by some is steamers."

chant steamers can be armed and equipped in every way made an objection to these vessels, with a power Will you tell me, in opposition to the authority

as steam frigates, I particularly invite the auention of the in consequence of this superior elevation which of such high sources, that these vessels are not

committee, and more particularly those of its members who

are familiar with such matters, to the fact of the Bombay' gives an increased range to her guns. She, there- | adapted for the purposes of war? They have steamer, nrw in the East India docks, and in every way fore, has the opposing vessel, no matter what her strength, velocity, and capacity beyond all ques- equal in fittings to any of her Majesty's vessels, and equally armament, completely in her power with the aid tion. That is the opinion which is expressed by etficient in every respect. This vessel has been fired to

carry two ten-inch guns, and ten medium thirty-two-pounof only one or two of these modern implements officers who are in your own service. But further,

ders, and, in my opinion, could carry with ease the heavy of warfare. This is the statement which is made ) I inay state a fact which is within my own knowl

thirty-two-pounders, or a proportionate number of sixtyto me, and it seems to be rational. Would there edge, and which may be found to be so if trial is eight-pounders, thereby rendering her equal, in every rebe any difficulty in a vessel, under such circum-made, on the question of strength. The only objec- speci, to any of her Majesty's paddle-wheel sieamers of the stances, taking her own position? And if she lion which is made to these vessels on the score of

same tonnage. This is a case which, in my opinion, con

pletely sets at rest any doubts as to the capabilities of our has power to take her own position, she avoids their armament is that they have one deck more merchant steamers for war purposes. The vessel is on the the danger to herself, and exposes her adversary than ordinary naval steamers, and that the upper spot; can be seen and surveyed by practical men. to her shot, one or two of which striking would deck, which is very elevated, is not strong enough

Ganges' is another instance of the same sort, and can be

seen at Blackwall." be sufficient for the purpose of destruction. To to bear an armament. Some say it cannot be say that vessels have always hitherto fought within sufficiently strengthened; but those acquainted Now, I venture the assertion, that neither of pistol-shot, is to go back to the time when wind with the subject say it can be strengthened for the

the vessels there mentioned approximates in speed, and sails were relied upon, and it is a frail argu- | purpose easily and readily. It will give an ad- tonnage, strength, or capacity, for the purposes ment to assume that vessels must engage now as vantage if strengthened, so as to carry ten inch of armament, to any one of the Collins steamers. formerly, when a new motive power has been guns. Of that there can be no question, because I submit, therefore, that these vessels are adapted introduced, and when velocity is not only accom- it would give them a greater range, and with their to the purposes of war, though not able to fight panied by the ordinary superiority of one sailing | velocity they could take their own position. As broadside to broadside; and that there is not a · vessel over another, but by the power to take a regards the walls of these vessels, they are two vessel in your Navy, that, when armed with a fixed relative position and retain that position. inches thicker than the walls of the Franklin proper crew, they could not demolish. But the That, it seems to me, alters the whole course of seventy-four. But it is said that they have not honorable Senator from Florida (Mr. MALLORY) naval warfare as between such vessels.

strength to sustain an armament on the upper deck. tells you, as I understood his staiement, that the I might pause, Mr. President, to enter into the weight of a ten-inch gun is 65 70-100 weight; British Government has abandoned the use of the many more details in reference to this, but I will

These vessels carry in their ice-houses side-wheel steamers, and converted them into proonly further state that I have read over a work every trip, a solid mass of fifty tons of ice on this pellers. With great deference to that honorable published by Mr. Stuart, formerly an engineer in very deck; and yet I am told that they could not Senator's opinion, I must beg leave to doubt the

Navy-a very beautifully illustrated work carry the ordinary armament of ten-inch guns whether, in a single instance, the British Goverain which he gives the dimensions, voyages, and on their upper deck, and ten thirty-two pounders ment has ever made such an alteration. timethe fastest, slowest, and mean time-of on the lower deck !

Mr. MALLORY. The honorable Senator misevery frigate in the Navy; and there is not one of Again, being without bowsprits, these vessels takes the statement which I made. It was not that them that, in strength or in velocity, has approx- can, with facility, train their guns to fire from the side wheel steamers had been converted into proimated to the Collins line. Details are given in | bow; and with their velocity, with a capacity to pellers, but that where the alteration had been regard to the whole; but I am not sufficiently carry even two ten-inch guns only, they would be made from their sailing ships, it had been into the acquainted with the technicalities of the matter to the most formidable steamers that you could em- screw propellers; and that the paddle-wheel steamintroduce them here.

ploy in your service. I have seen no sufficient ers had been condemned as war steamers. Shall I be told, then, that these men have not authority to convince me that the upper deck of

Mr. BAYARD. I understand that perfectly; complied with their contract to build for you ves- these vessels is not amply sufficient, even with- but the honorable Senator will excuse methough sels Buitable for purposes of war, when they have out additional strengthening, to carry a sufficient he might not have intended it and I hardly supbuilt vessels better than any which you have in l armament, and fire with that armament; but if we posed at the time that he did, but I did not wish your naval service? A remarkable evidence of the increase the strength by a few stanchions, in order io interrupt him he did use the expression that strength with which these vessels have been built, to sustain the upper deck, there can be no ques. || they had iaken off their side wheels.' I cannot be is, that with all the voyages they have made, in- | lion about it. It may be said that the mere mistaken, for I was sitting near him at the time. cluding winter passages, and by the northern | weight of the cannon is not the difficulty. I have He did not intend it. It was one of those slips of route, too, there has been but one of them caulked heard gentlemen say that one of these vessels | the tongue which will take place in the course of during the whole time, and that was the Atlantic, would fall to pieces if you were to attempt to fire debate. I am perfectly aware of the fact which and she was found to require very little in that a gun from her. I have read the report of the he states, that Great Britain has adopted the auxway. Sir, from all the information I have been answers of an officer in the British service, who || iliary power of steam, by means of propellers, able to acquire—and I have endeavored to ascer- was examined before a committee of the House of to make some of her ordinary line-of-battle ships lain the facts correctly-I consider that these ves- Commons in detail, who was a practical man,

steamers. I am aware of all that; but it determines sels are far superior to any steam frigates that you who had been previously appointed as superin- || nothing as to the question of the relative superihave in your Navy, quite equal to any steam frig. tendent for the purpose of making experimental ority of a side-wheel steamer constructed for the ate in the British Navy, and superior to most of practice in gunnery, and who was fully acquainted purposes of war, compared with a propeller. You the steamers in the merchant marine of Great Brit. ll with the subject. He tells us, in his answers,

could not convert a line-of-battle ship into a side ain. As regards the speed and other qualities of that the steamers in the British commercial marine wheel steamer, though you might put a propeller these vessels, I will advert briefly to some opin- | are generally from five hundred to one thousand | into it. It would be impracticable from the original ions of competent authorities, one of which was tons burden, and no more,--this was before the construction of the venselIt is a disputed quesread by the honorable Senator from Michigan Collins line was established: --that they can carry tion, 1 admit, as to the relative merits of the two, that of Commodore Stewart, of the Navy. Another Il from thirty-two to sixty-eight pounders,

and fire H but beyond all question the side-wheel steamer

no more.

Mail Steamer Appropriation BillDebate.

330 CONG....20 Sess.



would be inferior in an engagement broadside to mails, I feel myself justified in voting for the bill Gwin, James, Jones of lowa, Pettit, Rusk, Seward,

Shields, Stuart, Sumner, Thompson of Kentucky, Thombroadside; I consider, however, that velocity of the House, which will prevent the question

son of New Jersey, Walker, Weller, and Wright-25. with modern projectiles, if there is a decided supe- || from over again coming before Congress, until the riority on the part of the paddle-wheel steamer, contract terminates.

Mr. PEARCE. I move to amend the clause, which I believe there is, more than compensates Mr. PETTIT. Mr. President, I vote for the

by adding at the end of it: for increased vulnerability. That is a matter of | House bill

Provided, that the proprietors of said line shall agree to opinion; but still the experience of Great Britain First. Because it encourages American ship

such a modification of their existing contract as shall stipu

late for the payment, for the residue of the term limited in is such that she employs them both; and in the building, and this is necessary.

the original contract, after the 31st day of December, 1855, present war, the fleets in the Baltic, and in the Second. It encourages a spirit of enterprise in of $25,000 per trip, instead of $33,000 which they now reBlack Sea, there is, as far as I have seen in the offi. commerce among our fellow.citizens.

ceive, and the Postmaster General is hereby directed to cial reports and I have paid attention to them and Third. The ships rival England in steamship

make such modification of the contract. endeavored to ascertain no preference expressed navigation of the ocean; and this is a subject of Mr. President, I will state, very briefly, the by any officer against the side-wheel steamer in great and just pride to our citizens.

reasons which induce me to offer this amendment. any of the conflicts which have taken place, and Fourth. It is due to our national character to || I have thought that the allowance made to the they have had vessels of both kinds engaged in carry our mails abroad.

proprietors of this line was too large, while I have the operations in those seas. I admit that it is a Fifth. It is due to Collins & Co. from the past || also thought the allowance made by the original controverted question among naval men. I admit | implied, if not explicit, intention of Congress. contract was too small. The original contract that further experience alone can ultimately de- Sixth. It will furnish a strong, efficient, and re- provided for $385,000 a year for twenty trips. By termine it; but, 'in my judgment, sustained by the liable arm of defense in time of war.

the act of 1852 we added six to the number of trips, opinion of Commodore Stewart, the element of Seventh. It is the cheapest way of raising and an increase of thirty per centum in the service; but velocity decidedly overbalances the superiority maintaining a Navy, to increase which is my considering that those trips were, for the most part which ihe propeller would otherwise have, from ardent desire.

at all events, to be performed during the stormy, being less vulnerable than the side-wheel steamer; I shall not detain the Senate by elaborating each || wintry months, it seemed to me that it would be and that velocity is the first requisite, in a steamer, of these positions.

right to estimate the service at rather more than for the purposes of war.

The PŘESIDING OFFICER, (Mr. Weller.) | thirty per centum. As the service was required As regards this question of velocity, I know it The question is on the amendment of the Senator to be performed at a season more than usually has been sometimes said that the propeller might from Ohio, (Mr. Chase.)

stormy and inclement, I was willing to add to the be made equal in speed to the side-wheel steamer. Mr. PETTIT called for the yeas and nays; and ) $385,000, stipulated in the original contract, thirtyI have yet to see a given instance. The honorable || they were ordered.

three and a third per centum for the additional trips, Senator alluded to the voyage of the Himalaya to Mr. BELL. I have paired off with the Senator which would have been about $513,000. But ihe Australia. I should like to see a repetition of the il from Arkansas, (Mr. Johnson.) As he is not in ships which they constructed were much larger voyage, and have the time, distance, the character his place, he requested me to consider the engage- and of greater power and speed than those which of the sea she traverses, and the difficulties she ment of last night as still standing; I should vote they originally proposed. The increase of size has to encounter; for all these things must enter “no," and he would vote "aye.

may be estimated at fifty per centum above the into the question of relative speed, and when you Mr. DODGE, of Wisconsin. I have paired off | estimation of the original contract. have found a screw steamer crossing the ocean, with the honorable Senator from Mainc, (Mr. Now, I do not propose to add fifty per centum at all seasons of the year, by the most boisterous | Hamlin.)

increase to the amouni allowed for the performance passage, with the speed and regularity of the Col- The question being taken by yeas and nays, of the service, because, without doubt, a part of lins line, I shall be willing to admit the propeller resulted-yeas 16, nays 30; as follows:

the expense which they have thus sustained must to be of equal velocity with the side-wheel; but YEAS-Messrs. Adams, Butler, Chase, Clay, Dawson, have been incurred in the spirit of commercial until you give me something approximating to Evans, Fitzpatrick, Geyer, Hunter, Jones of Tennessee, speculation, with the view of an increased amount that, I beg leave to entertain doubis. Mallory, Sebastian, Slidell, Toombs, Toucey, and Wells

of passage money and freight. I think it is right I believe, sir, I have stated all that I deem NAYS-Messrs. Allen, Badger, Bayard, Benjamin, Brai.

to allow them something for the increased tonnage, necessary to vindicate my own vote. It sums up nerd, Bright, Brodhead, Brown, Cass, Clayton, Cooper, speed, and power of the vessels, as being a benefit in this way: A contract was originally made by Douglas, Foot, Gillette, Gwin, James, Jones of Iowa, Ma- to the mail service; but I do not think it is proper the Government, for a new enterprise, with certain

son, Pearce, Petit, Pratt, Rusk, Seward, Shields, Sinari,
Thompson of Kentucky, Thomaon of New Jersey, Walker, I by this amendment, to give them $650,000 a year,

to allow them the whole. I propose, therefore, citizens, at a specific sum, with a view to carry Wellcr, and Wright-30. out two avowed objects on the part of the Govern

So the amendment was rejected.

which, I think, would include a liberal addition to ment, to transport its mails, to prevent the entire postal service from falling into the hands of a

the $513,000, to which they would be entitled if we Mr. JONES, of Tennessee. I take it for granted

were to increase the original contract price by foreign Government in time of peace, and that the that the minds of Senators are entirely made up | thirty-three and a third per centum for the

amount vessels might be used for the purposes of war, if on this question, and although I should like to

of additional service which we have required. I war should come. For the purpose of carrying submit some remarks in reply to what has been do not care to inquire whether the investment of out that policy, at the solicitation of an oficer of said, I forbear to do so. I content myself with the company has been successful, and, of course, Government, Collins and his associates entered | offering the amendment which I withdrew yester

not to examine the amounts of expenditures and into a contract. In the performance of that con

day, to strike out the provision in the bill taking | receipts; for the taking of this contract to carry tract, in the prosecution of a new enterprise, they away the power to give notice, and in lieu of it, to the ocean mails does not require the Government sustained losses. There were difficulties and exinsert :

to guarantee the success and profit of a scheme penditures encountered which no foresight could And that the Secretary of the Navy is hereby directed | which, in its origin, looked quite as much to the calculate upon. They subsequently made appli

to give the notice provided in the first section of the act
enütled“ An act to supply deficiencies in the appropriations

returns of freight and passage money as to the cation to the Government, first, to advance them

for i he service of the fiscal year, ending the 30th of June, compensation for carrying the mails. Neither do a portion of the sum to be subsequently repaid, and 1852,” approved the 21st day of July, 1852, to terminate the I think that this Government can properly underwhich has been repaid out of their annual allowarrangement for the additional allowance for the transpor

take to sustain the company against the rivalry of ance. Afterwards, finding that, under the compe

tation of the United States mail between Liverpool and
New York in the Collins line of steamers, as therein pro.

foreign competition, however much our public tition with the British vessels, having to run a line

spirit and national pride may be interested in the against an established rival line, the expenditures Mr. ADAMS called for the yeas and nays, and

triumph of American skill, in the building and they could not proceed without enlarged compen- lows: were so great, and their Losses so serious, that they were ordered; and being taken, are as fol- | management of these fine ships.

But, sir, I shall say no more, as I find the Sen, sation, the Government, upon looking at the YEAS_Messrs. Adams, Butler, Chase, Clay, Dawson; // unwilling ears. When no order is kept, I will

ate is not in a condition to hear, and I speak to whole facts of the case, granted them an additional allowance on the ground, as I suppose, that, having Mallory, Mason, Sebastian, Slidell, Toombs, Wells, and not speak. entered into the contract, in which the objects of Wilson--17, the Government had been, certainly, as regards | nerd, Brodhead, Brown, Cass, Clayton, Cooper, Fessen

NAYS_Messrs. Allen, Badger, Bayard, Benjamin, Brai.

(During the taking of the last vote there was

great interest manifested to ascertain the result, the postal service, effected, it would not allow those who had embarked their capital to carry it

den, Foot, Gillette, Gwin, James, Jones of Iowa, Petrit

, ll and the closeness of the vote led to much specu

Pratt, Rusk, Seward, Stuari, Sumner, Thompson of Ken- lation in an under tone throughout the Chamber. out, to become losers under the technical opera

tucky, Thomson of New Jersey, Toucey, Walker, Weller, || This was the disorder to which Mr. PEARCE tion of the contract. That additional allowance and Wright-29.

alluded.) contained a proviso that Congress might, after a

So the amendment was rejected.

The PRESIDING OFFICER. There is too certain period, terminate it. They now apply to The bill was reported to the Senate without much noise in the Chamber. The question is on have that uncertainty removed, because they have amendment.

the amendment of the Senator from Maryland. experienced, and you have experienced, that a Mr. HUNTER. I renew the amendment of

Mr. BADGER called for the yeas and nays; capricious exercise of the power may be made, | the Committee on Finance, to strike out the clause and they were ordered. at any moment, when there is not more than a which takes away the power to give notice, and

Mr. ÓRATT. Mr. President, I do not know quorum of either House present. Under these on that question I ask for the yeas and nays.

that I precisely understand the amendment of my circumstances, deeming that it would be more equitable and just, and better serve the objects | taken, resulted-yeas 24, Days 25; as follows:

The yeas and nays were ordered; and being

colleague; and I rise as much for the purpose of

getting information, which I desire to govern my. intended to be accomplished-believing that, in YEAS-Messrs. Adams, Brodhead, Brown, Butler, Cass,

vote, as for any other purpose. The proposition point of fact, these men have carried out, without Chase, Clay, Dawson, Evans, Fitzpatrick, Hunter, Jones of my colleague seems to me to be obnoxious to regard to expense, their contract with the Govern- of Tennessee, Mallory, Mason, Morton, Pearce, Pratt, the objection which existed to the proposition of ment, in its essential particulars of constructing

Sebastian, Slidell, Toombs, Toucey, Wade, Wells, and the Senator from Ohio, The bill is a bill making vessels of the proper kind, and performing the NAYS-Messrs. Allen, Badger, Bayard, Benjamin,

an appropriation of money due to these persons terms of the contract in the transportation of the Il Brainerd, Bright, Clayton Cooper, Douglas, Foot, Gilerre,

for antecedent services. I looked, therefore, on




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