Where did you meet him in New York that year?-In Chatham street, or rather at the corner of Chatham street, on the steps of a hotel.

Did you meet him in Duane street ?-Yes.

What party of Fenians did he belong to?-At first he belonged to the Stephens and O'Mahony party, and until deprived of the State centership of Massachusetts.

Did he continue to belong to the Stephens and O'Mahony party after that ?—No. What party did he join then?—The Roberts party.

The CHIEF BARON. Were there two parties in the Fenian organization ?—Yes, my lord; there was a split.

The ATTORNEY GENERAL. Was he engaged in any position or employment when he was in New York ?—No.

Was he connected with any newspaper?-Some time before the war broke out-about 1859 he was; he, in company with

[Page of report No. 84.]

The CHIEF BARON. You first knew him in 1862 ?—Yes; I heard he was writing for this paper.

The ATTORNEY GENERAL. Did you hear it from himself?—Yes; I used to get this

paper.

The CHIEF BARON. He wrote, you say-for what paper?-For the Irish Messenger. Was that a Fenian paper?-No, it was not.

The ATTORNEY GENERAL.-Was he in any position when he was head center for the State of Massachusetts -I was told he kept a grocer's shop, but I am not sure of it. Had you any conversation with him on Fenianism ?-O, yes.

Did you know a newspaper called the Daily News, in New York ?-Yes.

Do you know he had anything to do with that paper?-He was reporter for it for some time.

The CHIEF BARON. When was that?-In 1855, I think.

He was a reporter for it for some time ?-Yes.

(To the prisoner:) Would you suggest anything I should ask this witness?—No. There is one discrepancy between his evidence and his informations. He swore in his direct evidence that I was State center for Massachusetts in 1863, whereas in his informations he said 1865.

WITNESS. I beg your pardon.

The PRISONER. I suppose it was written in mistake, like Gallagher's informations. WITNESS. There were two State centers since 1863, when he was State center.

The ATTORNEY GENERAL. The witness says in his informations that the prisoner was a prominent member of the Fenian organization in the American army. He also says, in 1865 I met him in Duane street; he was then head center. (To the witness :) How long was he State center for Massachusetts ?-There were two State centers since he was State center-Daniel Donovan, who was over here in Ireland, and the other, who is now acting as State center in Massachusetts, a man named Doody.

Mr. Justice KEOGH. He says it was in 1865 in his informations.

The ATTORNEY GENERAL. And he says it was 1863 in his evidence.

The PRISONER. I call your lordship's attention to his original informations.

The ATTORNEY GENERAL. The prisoner is quite right, my lord.

The CHIEF BARON (to the witness.) What do you say now?-Twice he was turned out of the position of State center; the man that got it then was Daniel Donovan; he occupied it in 1864, and when his year of office was up, the next man was Doody, who is now occupying the position of State center of Massachusetts.

The ATTORNEY GENERAL. That is since 1864 ?—Yes.

The CHIEF BARON. When was Doody appointed ?—In 1865.

The ATTORNEY GENERAL. Is he State center now?—Yes; he is continued.

[Page of report No. 85.]

The CHIEF BARON. Do you recollect that when you swore your informations. you said 1865-That is a mistake. I said I met him in New York in 1865.

What do you say is a mistake?—I think it is the date of when it was taken.

Was it that you mistook the date, or that it was taken down in error?

The PRISONER. Of course it is all a mistake of the transcriber; the witness made no mistake at all. He knew from some source, my lord, that I was going to ask him the question.

The CHIEF BARON. He was then the head center for Masschusetts ?—Yes, my lord. When did you meet him in Duane street?-In 1865.

Was he then occupying the position of head center?-No; for he was then connected with the Roberts party.

You were right, then, in saying that you met him in 1865 ?—Yes; he was then writing for the Daily News.

You say that he was then a head center for Massachusetts; that could hardly have been a mistake of the person who took it down, as it referred to the time you met him in New York. He was not the head centre in 1863-Doody was; there were two parties, the Roberts and O'Mahony parties.

RHODES

HOUSE

*OXFORD*

The CHIEF BARON (to the prisoner.) Do you suggest any other questions to be asked of the witness.

The PRISONER. I will ask him a few questions as to my recruiting in New York. Are you sure I recruited in New York?-Yes; you recruited some in New York and some in Charlestown.

Where in New York did I recruit ?-In David's island.

Where did I recruit-had I a tent, or room, or office there?—Yes; you had a recruiting tent in City Hall Park, New York.

Was I associated with any one?-Yes; a great many officers of the regiment-Captains Condon, Welsh, O'Neill, and almost all the officers of the regiment except those whom it was necessary to keep in David's island.

Don't you know that I was a resident of Boston, and that I arrived from it at New York on the 14th August, 1861, with 101 men whom I had recruited at Boston? I never recruited in New York, nor did I ever attend a Fenian meeting there in my life.-He was a captain in my regiment, my lord, and he did not recruit in New York.

I arrived from Boston, where I resided, at New York, with a company of 101 men, which I recruited in Boston, on the 14th August, 1861. I never recruited in New York; and I will make it a point to write to the governors of these States to show that I never recruited men either in the city or the State of New York.

The CHIEF BARON. That is of no use to you at present. (To the witness:) Did he recruit in the places mentioned by you?-He did, my lord; there were three companies recruited by him in Boston; but as a good many of them deserted on their way to New York, he had to get his companies recruited in New York.

What you say, then, is this: Is it that he brought some of them from Boston, and recruited others in New York?—Yes, my lord.

[Page of report No. 86]

The PRISONER. Permit me, my lord, to introduce a witness on this question.

The CHIEF BARON. By and by you can do that, as soon as the Crown closes their case. I cannot receive any witness from you until the case from the Crown is closed; then you will have every opportunity of doing so. Be good enough to have your witnesses In attendance, so as not to have any delay.

The PRISONER. My witness, my lord, is Mr. Nagle, a member of the same brigade. He is a prisoner; but if he is produced he can prove that I neither recruited in New York, nor had I a tent there.

The CHIEF BARON. He is one of the parties against whom an indictment was found, and, as a rule, the law prevents a party in such circumstances from being examined. I am afraid you can't examine him.

The PRISONER. I simply raise the question for the sake of security. As I said yesterday, I ignore the jurisdiction of this court-I don't recognize it.

The CHIEF BARON. That is no matter. What you said yesterday will not pervent me hearing any suggestion you have to offer.

The PRISONER. I know that, my lord.

Acting Sergeant FRANCIS SHERIDAN examined by the ATTORNEY GENERAL: You are an acting sergeant of police?—I am.

You remember the 5th of March last?—Yes.

Where were you then on duty?—I was on duty at Milltown, in the suburbs of Dublin. I was sergeant then.

How many constables had you with you?-There were three.

Where did you patrol that night ?-We patroled down Milltown road and through Milltown village, in the county of Dublin.

Did you meet any body of men on that night-Yes; about twelve o'clock, 1,000 men came armed with rifles, fixed bayonets, pikes, and revolvers.

Were they marching when you met them?-They marched four deep, in military

array.

Had they anything with them?—They had a van in front, and an outpost in charge of it.

Was there any person apparently acting as commander?—Yes; there was.
What was his name?-Lennon.

Did you hear him give any orders to that party?—Yes; he gave orders for the men to stop, and they made prisoners of us and disarmed us.

Were you in uniform at the time?-The men and myself were in uniform, and on duty.

Had you arms?-Yes, we had swords and revolvers.

Did you do anything with these arms?-They disarmed us by the orders of the man in command.

Where were you placed when you were disarmed? In the center of the party with rifles and pikes.

[Page of report No. 87.J

They had rifles and pikes?-Yes, sir.

Where did the party move who had you placed in the center ?-They proceeded across Milltown bridge, through Dundrum and Windy harbor.

Where did you proceed from Dundrum?-We went to a place called Old Connaught. We went first from Dundrum, and then to Stepaside.

Is Stepaside in the county of Dublin?-It is, sir.

The CHIEF BARON. Old Connaught is in the county of Dublin?-It is in the county of Dublin, my lord.

The SOLICITOR GENERAL. Did you hear Lennon give any order to the men who were in the party?—Yes; he ordered them to proceed to the front of Stepaside police station, and then they made an attack on the station.

He ordered the riflemen to come forward?—Yes; in front of the constabulary police barrack.

Was this when you had reached Stepaside?—Yes, sir.

What did you observe done then?-A number fired into the front of the barrack, and demanded of the constabulary in the barrack to surrender in the name of the Irish republic.

Did the men surrender?-The party outside broke the windows and put straw in through them to burn the police out, when they would not surrender in the first instance.

Did the constabulary come out?-The insurgents got a sledge and broke in the door. What occurred when the door was broken?-The constabulary were brought out from the barrack and made prisoners along with us.

How many?—I believe four men or five; I think four men and a sergeant.

What was done then?--I saw the party made prisoners of. The party who made prisoners of the constabulary put on the constabulary accoutrements.

What do you mean by accoutrements?-Knapsacks and belts.

Did the party move on then?-They took the rifles out of the barrack and moved on in the direction of Bray.

Were the constabulary who were taken out of the barrack taken away with you?— Yes, sir.

Did they go into Bray?-They stopped at a place called Old Connought, this side of Bray. They then sent a party to the town of Bray to know whether they could proceed there, and word came back that they could not proceed, as the military were coming on the train from Dublin. It was so conjectured among themselves; we heard them say so. They then returned to Glencullen constabulary police station. The riflemen were ordered in front of the station. They demanded the constabulary in charge of the station to surrender in the name of the Irish republic. The constabulary refused, and then the party outside fired into the barrack.

Who fired in?-A number of the insurgents outside.

What did the constabulary who were inside do?—They fired out upon them.

[Page of report No. 88.]

Was any one hit or wounded?—Yes; there was one man shot convenient to me; one of the insurgents was wounded from the barrack.

What was done when the man was wounded?-We were ordered forward, to be exposed to the fire; we were put in front of the fire from the barrack. Some of the insurgents were behind us.

The CHIEF BARON. Were there not any of them between you and the barrack ?—No, my lord.

Were you put between them-between the wall and the police station?-Yes, my lord.

The SOLICITOR GENERAL. What was done with the man who was wounded?-He was ordered by the man in command to be taken to the van that had the ammunition in it.

What became of the men in the barrack in the end?-The sergeant who was along with us was compelled to go over to the window and speak to the constable in charge of the station.

The CHIEF BARON. Was that the Milltown man?-No; the Stepaside constable, my, lord.

He was compelled to go over where?-To the barrack window, and to speak to the constable in charge inside.

To say what?-That if he would surrender the arms and ammunition in the barrack he would give the prisoners he had outside in exchange for the arms and ammunition. The SOLICITOR ĜENERAL. Did they do that?-They did. They gave the arms and ammunition and other accoutrements belonging to the constabulary from the barrack. And were you released then?-We were, sir.

The CHIEF BARON. Prisoner, can you suggest any question to ask this witness? PRISONER. No, my lord. don't know any of these movements he talks of. I never minded them, my lord.

The CHIEF BARON. Mr. Attorney General, have you any further parol evidence ?

The ATTORNEY GENERAL. No, my lord, we close as regards porol evidence; but we wish to put in some documents.

The CHIEF BARON. It will be better to postpone doing that until I have put some questions to the witness Buckley.

The ATTORNEY GENERAL. Very well, my lord.

DANIEL J. BUCKLEY recalled and further examined:

The CHIEF BARON. Now, prisoner, if there is any question you wish to suggest that I should ask the witness, or if you wish to ask him any question yourself, you can do so. Perhaps it is better for you to wait until I have put the questions which occur to me to ask him, but you may do so now if you prefer it.

The PRISONER. I presume that the same discrepancies in his evidence have occurred to your lordship's mind as have occurred to me, and I would sooner wait till your lordship has done.

[Page of report No. 89.]

The CHIEF BARON. I will ask the witness some questions as to points which occur to me as desirable to inquire into, and you can afterwards put any questions to him that you think right. (To witness:) Have the goodness to state again the oath which you took on becoming a Fenian.-Not to divulge the secrets connected with the organization, as well as not to divulge anything connected with the expedition.

Was that the form of the oath-That was the form of it.

Do you remember what you swore in your informations? I believe you swore one information on the 12th September, and another on the 10th October-did you swear any others besides those?—I believe those are the only informations.

The ATTORNEY GENERAL. He made only two, my lord; but the original information was re-sworn by him in the presence of the several prisoners.

The CHIEF BARON. In your information of the 12th September you mention that the oath administered to you was that you should obey those who would be placed over you, and that you would not divulge the secrets of the expedition?-That did not belong to the oath.

What did not belong to the oath ?-That I would obey those placed over me; that did not belong to the oath taken by me.

Then that was not part of the oath ?-No, sir.

Where was it you met the parties who accompanied you on the expedition ?—Canal street. I went to Broadway first, and afterwards to Canal street.

What did you mean by saying in your information that you had to go down to Grant street? That was to take the steamer there.

But you did not embark from Grant street?-We took the steamer at Canal street. Is that near Canal street?-The wharf is there.

Is Grant street near Canal street.-I never said Grant street; I made no reference at all to Grant street; it was Canal street, not Grant street.

In your information you state that Grant street was the place?-That is a mistake. PRISONER. I am very well acquainted in New York, and it contains no such street as Grant street.

WITNESS. I did not say Grant street; I said Canal street.

The CHIEF BARON. I observe in your information you do not mention anything about Colonel Phelan, Colonel Devan, Colonel O'Doherty, nor about James Lawless ?—No, my lord.

How did you happen not to recollect those persons?—Not being well acquainted with them, and having to recollect some 40 odd names.

You said in your evidence here that three colonels went on shore before the wounded men left the ship?-Yes.

And you said that two of the colonels went on shore with Burke?-Yes.
Then there were five colonels in all went on shore?—No, only four.

[Page of report No. 90.]

How did it happen you did not recollect the names of these persons when making your information?-In giving that information I did not recollect those names. Did anything occur to make you recollect them afterwards?—Yes, sir.

What occurred?-Simply getting some paper and writing down those names to recollect them.

Did you receive any information as to who they were before you wrote down their names on the paper?-None, sir.

Was it after you made your information that you recollected those names?-Yes, sir. Was your memory refreshed in any way?—Yes, sir; I felt a great deal excited on the occasion of giving that information.

How was your memory refreshed?-By having more time to look over them.

Had those men been arrested at the time you gave your first information?—Yes, sir. Did you know they were arrested?—I did.

Did you know who they were?—Yes, sir.

Did you learn their names?—Oh, I knew their names long before that time.

What I ask you is, did you learn the names of those persons who were arrested before you gave your information?-I had known them before that, sir.

Attend to the question. Did you know who were arrested at the time you gave your first information ?—I did, sir.

Did you know them by name- -who they were ?-I did, sir.

And, if you did, how did it happen that among those who were arrested and named to you there should have been a number of persons whose names you forgot?-They were not all arrested.

The ATTORNEY GENERAL. The party were not all arrested, my lord; Doherty, Shea, Devan, and Phelan were never arrested.

PRISONER. My lord, the witness was in the same prison with us, and exercised in the same yard up to the 12th of October, when he gave his information.

The CHIEF BARON. I am speaking now of the persons whom he did not name in his information, but whom he named yesterday.

PRISONER. Quite so, my lord. I intended to call your lordship's attention to it as a remarkable coincidence.

The CHIEF BARON, (to witness.) There is another point: you stated in your evidence yesterday that the arms which were on board were packed in large-sized boxes, that there was a Spanish name upon them, and that they were placed between decks; you also stated that there was ammunition in one of those boxes which was opened, containing about a million and a half of cartridges, as you understood; and you then stated, after describing the artillery, that the cases in which the arms were were opened during the voyage-Yes.

And that the arms were so placed as to be ready to distribute?—Yes.

And you were asked how they were so placed, and you said they were put in twos and threes, and that they were rearranged in the boxes-in the same boxes?—Yes.

[Page of report No. 91.]

That was your evidence yesterday. I shall now read what you stated in your information: "We had a quantity of arms on board; I could not say what quantity; they were packed in cases as pianos and sewing machines; they included a quantity of carbines and rifles.” In your statement here your said they were revolvers. You then proceed to say: "These boxes were consigned to a firm in Cuba. Many of those cases were opened during the voyage, and the arms packed in smaller boxes." In your evidence yesterday you said they were opened, and the arms laid in twos and threes in the same large boxes. In your information you say they were opened and the arms packed in smaller boxes; how do you reconcile those two statements?-My lord, I stated in my evidence yesterday that the arms were placed in two boxes, one outside of the other, for more safe-keeping; on repacking and rearranging they were only left in the inner box.

PRISONER. The witness also said, in his first information, that he did not know the quantity of arms on board; in his evidence yesterday, he swears to 5,000 at least.

The CHIEF BARON. How do you reconcile that ?--In making reference to the quantity yesterday, I merely intended to be understood as stating far short of the number of arms actually on board. It is true I did not know the exact quantity.

That is to say, you yesterday merely intended to indicate that there was at least that quantity, but you could not tell how much?—Yes.

Why did you not make any mention of the ammunition in your information ?—I did not recollect it at the time.

You say you had opportunities of seeing between decks?—Yes.

How was the ammunition placed between decks-was anything placed under it ?— Yes, there were some boxes under it.

Were there any over it?-None over it. There were arm boxes under it.

Was it placed in the part of the ship in which you slept ?—No, it was some 20 or 25 feet from me.

But you passed through it occasionally?-I passed it often.

How did you happen to forget it when making your information?—The question was not asked of me. There are other things in connection with the expedition that I have not given any evidence of, because I was not asked.

What are those things-do you recollect them now?—Yes, I do, sir.

What are they?-The building of a raft was one.

What about that?-This raft was intended, with two other boats, to hold the people in case the ship was pursued. These were to be launched, and the ship blown up or set fire to.

Do you recollect anything else?—No, sir.

You mentioned yesterday that you heard what passed in the cabin between the officers and Gallagher, the pilot ?-I only heard part of what passed.

Why did you say nothing of that in your information ?—I never thought of that, sir. [Page of report No. 92.]

Explain how it occurred. You were describing in your information what occurred with reference to Gallagher; you stated that while in Sligo bay you took a pilot on